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Editorial: Are you a prisoner of the unlock code?

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C:Amie Page Icon Posted 2005-04-12 3:24 PM
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If you have used a PDA for any length of time, then you will probably be familiar with the concept that with a volatile device, sometimes mistakes happen. For whatever reason, be it a bad install, a chanced lapse of judgement or any number of end game events, sometimes we just need to start off from scratch.

The next time this happens to you, could you be in situation to unwittingly discover that you too have become a prisoner of the software unlock code?
John Ottini explains why the practices of some developers to require interactive software activation could prove to be a major downfall for users if not immediately, but in the future.


What can be done to discourage developers from choosing this path? Should it be discouraged? and how should developers combat piracy on the P2P age?

Let us know what you think here on the forum.

View: Are you a prisoner of the unlock code?
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Nick Charlton Page Icon Posted 2005-04-12 3:36 PM
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I feal sorry for small developers and this P2P age, The likes of Microsoft could be debatable though.

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sophisticatedleaf Page Icon Posted 2005-04-12 7:23 PM
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I think our only real chance now is to go open-source...
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Snappy! Page Icon Posted 2005-04-12 9:02 PM
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I have the license for a couple of software for PalmOS. Most of the time, requesting for a resend of the registration code is automated, so one just have to get online and you can get it via email or their web site in a few seconds.

I'm not sure if this system where the registration code is tied to the UserId for each Palm is helping to keep piracy low and price down, but I'm comfy with it.
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C:Amie Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 8:23 AM
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Trouble is, as John pointed out. What happens when the developer goes belly up, or decides they no longer want to continue the product.
Worse, what if they want to release a new version and force everyone to upgrade. Imagine if (when) Microsoft change Windows Product activation so that you have to upgrade to Windows 2020, and can't stay with Windows 2011.

We will all more to open source then - assuming it still exists in 2020.

The crux of the matter is does the developer have the right to disctate when as well as how you can use their product.
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Hurricane John Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 9:15 AM
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When it comes to the Handheld PC platform and the way in which developer's & their websites disappear overnight... one should be reluctant to buy any software product that doesn't afford the user/buyer the maximum amount of freedom in terms of future use.

For example, I own several Ilium Software products which I will be able to use far into the future even though (sadly) Ilium no longer upgrades or supports there Handheld PC software catalog.

What happens to the developer should be of no consequence to my ownership and use of my registered copy of the product.

Isn't this how it should be?
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Snappy! Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 9:17 AM
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C:Amie - 2005-04-13 6:23 AM

Trouble is, as John pointed out. What happens when the developer goes belly up, or decides they no longer want to continue the product.
Worse, what if they want to release a new version and force everyone to upgrade. Imagine if (when) Microsoft change Windows Product activation so that you have to upgrade to Windows 2020, and can't stay with Windows 2011.

We will all more to open source then - assuming it still exists in 2020.

The crux of the matter is does the developer have the right to disctate when as well as how you can use their product.


hmmm ... ... I guess product activation is somewhat different from the normal registration key thingie. But it can be written such that the software will expire at some point in the future ... ...

While most products have a stated warranty period where the product has to work within reasonable parameters, softwares seem to drop off the warranty period mostly. I know that the EULA for most software states that the user can have tech support for 90days or something. But so far, I've almost never needed to reach tech support for those software I gotten. I think my usage pattern is like this: I'll try it out and if it has bugs that are ridiculous to me, I would just drop it. So mostly, when I do get a software, it should have been able to do 80% ~ 90% of what I need. Being a programmer myself, I kinda tend to be less patient with silly bugs.

So, if the software fails to run when I upgrade to a new OS or something, I kinda accept my part of the deal, that I already got what I paid for, as stated in its design specs ... eg runs on Win95 etc etc ...

oops ... I think I've gone off topic ... ... yes, I agree that software should not be time-limited, and if it is, it should be stated upfront clearly, like shareware does. Customers should not be surprised by a product DEactivation sometime in the future. Having said that, customers should not be expecting same level of support years after the EOL of a product. Try to remember that the computer industry is not like ... I hestitate to quote any industry here! ... I think every industry has its complexity, except that the computer industry happen to have a rather significant rate of change (or progress as some might say) ... the ability to maintain support teams (which comprise not just of phone support, but teams of developers, SDTs, SDEs etc) for older products can be trying.

Hopefully more companies have the heart to release their source code when they fold up or when they have milked enough $$ from them.
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Uncle Ben Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 9:31 AM
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C:Amie - 2005-04-13 8:23 AM

Trouble is, as John pointed out. What happens when the developer goes belly up, or decides they no longer want to continue the product.
Worse, what if they want to release a new version and force everyone to upgrade. Imagine if (when) Microsoft change Windows Product activation so that you have to upgrade to Windows 2020, and can't stay with Windows 2011.

We will all more to open source then - assuming it still exists in 2020.

The crux of the matter is does the developer have the right to disctate when as well as how you can use their product.


The crux of the matter is NOT about developers dictating to users how and when they can use their products, but about developers protecting their intellectual property, and ensuring that users live up to the terms of the licensing agreement that accompanies the software.

What happens when a developer goes belly up ...Well, what happens when a car manufactuer goes belly up? What happens when a manufacturer drops a platform (e.g., NEC, HP and their line of HPCs).

I'm not worried about 2020 - by then, my device will long have been sent to pasture, no doubt, and I will probably do all my computing by using verbal commands and dictating to my device. Handwriting recognition will have been replaced (it's already out there on desktops) with voice recognition; and keyboards and stylus pens will have become redundant by then. Much of the existing software will be gathering dust.

I can just see HPCFactor's editorials like - "How do you talk to your HPC" and polls on how long it took users to train their HPC device to their voice, etc.

That being said, there are registration schemes that I truly dislike - Inesoft's Cash Organizer, for one; and SoftMaker, to a lesser extent, where one must obtain a new customer ID with every change of email address. But I still feel that developers have every right to protect their intellectual assets the way they see fit; and we, as consumers of their products, have every right to buy or decline their products if we don't like their licensing agreement and registration process.

That my 2 cents' ... for whatever it's worth.
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Uncle Ben Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 9:36 AM
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Hurricane John - 2005-04-13 9:15 AM

When it comes to the Handheld PC platform and the way in which developer's & their websites disappear overnight... one should be reluctant to buy any software product that doesn't afford the user/buyer the maximum amount of freedom in terms of future use.

For example, I own several Ilium Software products which I will be able to use far into the future even though (sadly) Ilium no longer upgrades or supports there Handheld PC software catalog.

What happens to the developer should be of no consequence to my ownership and use of my registered copy of the product.

Isn't this how it should be?


I agree. But I would not refrain from buying a solid application if it fulfills my needs, only because of the registration process. Considering the small investments that most HPC/PPC software represents, I don't see the licensing/registration process being a showstopper in any way.
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C:Amie Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 10:00 AM
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Ah but using the metaphore of a car manufacturer is somewhat different. You can still drive the car after it breaks down, even if the manufacturer goes under. You tow it to another garage, an independant mechanic fixes it and you drive off.

When a software developer goes under and your H/PC breaks down, you can't take the software to another person to get working again.
Protection of intellectual property rights is all well and good. However where does the barrier need to form between addressing the developers protection needs and addressing the needs of the consumer long term.

This is a very contentious issue for us in the H/PC community. It has to be. With so many developers migrating over to the Pocket PC as they do, their users face a problem.
Utopiasoft did a good thing when they went, releasing an unlock key; there by turning off the activation requirement.
It's my personal opinion that somethime after 2012 Microsoft will do similar with Windows XP activation. They can't / wont update the activeation so that in my view is the next best thing to open source it.

Windows Activation is just a hyper-automated version of what John is discussing, but as we all know that to anyone determined it hasn't stopped the hackers and crackers. Windows XP is freely available in Warez circles, I've cleaned out and reported a few in my time.

As to Windows 2020, I used 2011 and 2020 as an example to not encroach on trademarks
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bruisedquasar Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 10:31 AM
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It seems to me that we should view the copyright-piracy "issue" in context, not in the narrow way big corporations like Microsoft & Adobe or even Sony Music want us to do.

I begin by first addressing Microsoft's claim that it is losing too much money to domestic piracy. Second, I consider other rich corporations that have made, and still make, similar claims. Music companies have tried to block new consumer electronics as far back as small reel to reel tape recorders. They went crazy over 8-track cassette players and later cassette players that can record. They screamed again over the introduction and popularity of CD and then DVD recorders. The movie giants beat their chests over VCRs that can record and they poured 100s of millions into Washington DC until they got a fed law that requires all VHS players to have a chip that shuts down recording immediately upon discovery that the master VHS tape has a copyright. No VHS recorder made in the last few years and sold in USA will record even a 20 year old abandoned movie, an independent film which no longer has any party who claims copyright. This is the same as a technology that would prevent any one from publishing a classic novel because existing copies contain a copyright mark!

The Fed requires the Chip but does not require honesty in advertising dual VHS or recording DVD players. The verbage on the boxes is clearly written to give consumers the idea that they can record their favorite tapes or DVDs. Of course, there are several legitimate reasons to record copyright material. A major one is the medium deteriates over time. Film buffs can no longer preserve their classic movie collection because they can no longer copy them to fresh VHS tape.

Now, why should the public tolerate--remember we are the government in the USA--copyrights at all? To encourage creativity, to encourage works of art & expensive documentaries, etc. Copyright is not and never was intended as a right to get stinking rich, which is what huge, rich, greedy firms such as Sony Music, Sony Movies & Microsoft are demanding. How big of a piracy problem is there when a single hit song can make an illiterate person rich beyond imagination? That music firms can invest millions and an army of employees and company lawyers to tracking down kids trading music online with P2P software suggests to me that they make too much money, so easily that they have time and resources to devote to threatening kids, most of whom are somewhat poor and thus not potential buyers. Their alternative to getting free inferior sound MP3 format songs is to listen to the radio. Actually, they could legally record superior sounding music from their book shelf, Dolby Sound filter stereos.

My friends and I used to do just that and the popular FM stations had days they would play entire albums non-stop so we could record albums. We did this because Music companies seemed to record music on the cheapest cassette tapes they could find. We used dolby and high quality tape to produce better sounding copies than we could buy!

The US Federal government is the people, so it is proper to ask: "why should we prevent ourselves and certain ones among us from copying copyrighted material?" So Microsoft can bring in record breaking profit margins of 30 to 40 billion a year? So Bill Gates alone can take in billions--I repeat billions--a year? Are you aware that Gates personally "donates" $240 million a year, one check to the Democratic National Party, one to the Republican National Party? How can he be both Republican and Democrat, conservative and liberal?

Reel-to-reel tape recorders, 8 tracks, cassettes according to all independent studies INCREASED--did not decrease--copyright sales. The same was true with software when it came on floppy discs that we easily copied. I was a member of a non-profit group that bought over priced software and loaned it ("rented" to members. Of course, we installed the software on our PCs before mailing it back. Independent studies found time after time that such clubs increased software sales. Yet, the software giants Adobe, Microsoft, Lotus 1,2,3 screamed. The reason members participated in the club was so they could find out if the expensive software was what the firm claimed it was, if it worked well on their system, etc. Peter Norton and McAfee started out sharware publishers. It is still easy to swipe their software. It always has been. If you wait until the end of a year, it is sold very cheap anyway. These gifted men comprehend that if a person swipes Norton utilities of Macafee anti-virus, most will soon buy update services. Neither Norton or McAfee will ever be as rich as a Bill Gates or a Enron CEO but they are in the top .2% of American income earners. They cannot buy a small nation like Gates could but is that what copyright is for?

We have a set of sound anti-monopoly, anti-corporate collusion and price fixing laws designed to protect the Public and to protect the US ECONOMY. The Microsoft cartel violates them all and Janet Reno knew & proved this. It is not time for stupid draconian copyright protections that only hurt the consumer. It is time for us to demand Washington enforce US fair trade laws. How? Demand a low ceiling of political donations OF ANY KIND. Limit someone like Gates or Soros (not even a US citizen, by the way) to "Donating $10,000 a year maximum to any political party and demand national Political Parties must, by law, itemize, every cent they "spend." We do it to the unions. We need to do it to the Parties.

"Piracy" is a misused word today. A copyright material pirate is not a consumer but a group that illegally copies and SELLS copyrighted material. The US consumer is not a pirate that costs giant firms a ton of lost profits. The pirate is the entire nation of communist China. 24 hours after a movie is released in the USA pirate copies of all kinds are ready to hit the streets. When I am in Thailand, for instance, I can buy a high quality DVD of any US movie still running in first run theaters for $3 tops, a lower quality DVD for $2 and a VHS tape made from a hand held cam for 50 cents. They come from nearby China.

On the streets of any Asian country I visit, S. Korea, Taiwan, Thailand, Hongkong, Sinapore, even US territory Puerto Rico, I can buy a Chinese pirate copy of any English language book for under $3. I can buy quality Music CDs for $1.. Get this. People like me find it easier to carry on knives and other terrorist materials than get by US customs with pirated CDs, DVDs, VHS, Books, software. knock off Macs. This alone convinces me that both of our national political parties and thus our government is corrupt. America is not the only country without government corruption. We are the only country that has a legal bribe system and the bribes are tax deductible. People like Gates and Soros deduct the millions they "donate" to politicians.

There is a legal way to rebel. The rebellion is the Open Source (software) Movement, the new double copyright symbol type copyright, GNU organization. Use and encourage people to use free Open Office (made and owned by Sun Microsystems) instead of extremely overpriced MS Office, which carries the same bugs from version to version. Linux Operating System. Those who have tried and abandoned Linux in the past really need to take a look at the free versions of Xandros Linux 3.5 and Mandrake Linux 10.1. Newly released Xandros is easier to install than Win XP and a fully supported version is cheaper than a copy of Windows ME or 2000.

Also rebel by always keeping in mind that Computing magazines and the main PC gerus are de facto on the payroll of the big advertisers. Gateway got gerus and magazines to give them year after year top service and product rewards. Dell was always vastly superior to Gateway but Gateway ran very expensive multi-page ads in every issue of all four top PC magazines. Only after they stopped doing this did the public start reading that Gateway has poor service and quality is none too hot either. Now, it is Dell that runs multi-page articles in every issue of every top PC magazine...

A lot of quality free software comes with each Linux distribution. For instance, Xandros comes with Firefox and three other excellent Linux web browsers, games, drawing programs, Open Office, three additional word processors, etc.

Xandros comes with an automatic compiler. You can chose to compile programs yourself (in case you wish to alter or hack them first) or you can have Xandros do it as you install them.

Yes, there is a learning curve to migrating to Linux but...have you tried reinstalling Windows XP, especially after you installed SP2??

...OF COURSE...THIS IS ALL MERELY MY HUMBLE OPINION...

--Bruised
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Snappy! Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 10:56 AM
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Quote

"Piracy" is a misused word today. A copyright material pirate is not a consumer but a group that illegally copies and SELLS copyrighted material. The US consumer is not a pirate that costs giant firms a ton of lost profits. The pirate is the entire nation of communist China. 24 hours after a movie is released in the USA pirate copies of all kinds are ready to hit the streets. When I am in Thailand, for instance, I can buy a high quality DVD of any US movie still running in first run theaters for $3 tops, a lower quality DVD for $2 and a VHS tape made from a hand held cam for 50 cents. They come from nearby China.


I think you might want to qualify your statement "entire nation of" ... no doubt piracy is rampant there, but to make a blanket statement like that ...

Quote

On the streets of any Asian country I visit, S. Korea, Taiwan, Thailand, Hongkong, Sinapore, even US territory Puerto Rico, I can buy a Chinese pirate copy of any English language book for under $3. I can buy quality Music CDs for $1.. Get this.


I'm not sure about other countries, but Singapore? and any English book? under $3? Come on! ... I think your Asian country bashing is getting out of hand here ... I grew up in Singapore and peddlers on the street cannot be seen since the early 70s. And back then, before they were removed, I doubt English literacy was so high that any pirates would hawk an English language book ... never mind for $3.

Maybe you can tell me which street in Singapore you found "Chinese pirate copy of any English language book" for under $3. It would be interesting for a Singaporean to not know of such a "deal" after staying in Singapore for so long.
(I am currently a resident in US)

Quote
There is a legal way to rebel. The rebellion is the Open Source (software) Movement, the new double copyright symbol type copyright, GNU organization. Use and encourage people to use free Open Office (made and owned by Sun Microsystems) instead of extremely overpriced MS Office, which carries the same bugs from version to version. Linux Operating System. Those who have tried and abandoned Linux in the past really need to take a look at the free versions of Xandros Linux 3.5 and Mandrake Linux 10.1. Newly released Xandros is easier to install than Win XP and a fully supported version is cheaper than a copy of Windows ME or 2000.


I'm with you on Open Source, but I'm not sure if its good to lump Asian (piracy) bashing with Open Source. After all, the Communist China that you speak of is one of the strongest country that is currently supporting Open Source projects. Its government is implementing (or implemented) linux desktop (and servers?) deployment for many of its government agencies.

Bruised, much of your statements and comments are valuable and insightful, but you may want to keep your sentiments and blanket statements in check.

EDIT:
And I substantiate my statement thus:

By David Legard, IDG News Service
August 11, 2004
Reports: Open-source software alliance formed in China
Alliance with IBM, HP, and others aims to promote open-source development and application in China
http://www.infoworld.com/article/04/08/11/HNopensourcechina_1.html

November 5, 2002
China to be Stronghold for Open Source
http://www.internetnews.com/dev-news/article.php/1494881

TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 09, 2002 01:29:29 AM]
Open IT: Govt to rewrite source code in Linux
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/articleshow?artid=24598...

Edited by Snappy! 2005-04-13 11:04 AM
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Hurricane John Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 11:38 AM
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Ben wrote

The crux of the matter is NOT about developers dictating to users how and when they can use their products, but about developers protecting their intellectual property, and ensuring that users live up to the terms of the licensing agreement that accompanies the software.

What happens when a developer goes belly up ...Well, what happens when a car manufactuer goes belly up? What happens when a manufacturer drops a platform (e.g., NEC, HP and their line of HPCs).




I'm not debating that the fact that some developers are doing this to protect their intellectual property, but the crux of the matter is that by making you a prisioner of the unlock code they are indeed dictating how and when you can use their products.

as for "What happens when a manufacturer drops a platform?" Well, my favorite Handheld PC doesn't become useless the first time I have to perform a hard reset because it requires a unlock code from the manufacturer for me to use it.

Edited by Hurricane John 2005-04-13 11:45 AM
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C:Amie Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 11:45 AM
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OK, I would like to point out that this isn't a US board, so standing on a national pedestal and preaching isn't going to get you very far.

Having though some personal - but limited - knowledge of the US political system, especially relating to the events of the last 6 / 7 years, as a European I am grossly appalled at the state that the government which proclaims to be the greatest and freest on Earth (and is all too happy to make sure we know they believe it - to their own detriment I might add). I am worse horrified by the underpinnings of the current US administration to find ways to skirt around and whole heartedly undermine and mock the attempts and legislation made by those few who do have some vision of what freedom of government is all about.

Power corrupts; as the saying goes may well be true. However I think more apt to use in our case here is that the trappings of power blind. Just as those in political power want to kid to themselves that these donations are all just and moral for the better aim of the United States, the likes of the MPAA and RIAA effervesce (or is that foam) on the belief that all new things are a threat and that nothing new can and should be embraced come hell or high water.

You example of the consumer forcing their hand, and the long term benefits of your trading club are good ones, very true and it shows that where there is momentum things can change. However the corporate dinosaur once again rears up amidst the change and starts to claw at the walls as they are dragged on. Excuses are found, alliances are forged, lobbies are made, and verily be thy nature consumers are scapegoat as the root of all evil.

To these industry consortiums and bodies. I do not think that as you put it "national", meaning inter-US piracy is the issue. I think that the issue is in the international, wider domain.
When you can pickup the latest Windows, Office, DVD release in a market bazaar in Beijing for $2 and this is a prolific issue in *some* parts of Asia, as it can indeed be anywhere in the world from a UK car boot sale to a slum in Buenos Aires or a boarder run point in San Diego.
P2P is just an a-physical form of this, cross boarder, cross culture, cross legal jurisdiction. p2p itself is a cesspit for the dregs of the IT world to play their games, from the hackers and the virus and Trojan writers to the hardened black-hat cyber criminals. If the p2p makers didn't count on this then they wouldn't pretend in any uncertain terms that their networks are secure and "oh it's for legit reasons we can't help the odd few who warez". Like hell it's for legit reasons.

Moving back into the Handheld PC. If the likes of PlanMaker and TextMaker were an open source initiative, do you think we would have got them?
I would say no. The payware model is what has enabled SoftMaker to construct the application and pay the developers and do everything with it they wanted to do. Had they tried to o0pen source it, in this community. Even in the entire Windows CE community do I think we would have it.. No, I don't.
Marketing on services is all well and good, but I don't want services and gimmicks around a product, I want the product.
I can openly accept that the Open Source business model is good on the grounds of keeping applications out there in the community - it would indeed solve the issue we are debating here as another developer could come and pick it up and re-release it to existing customers of a defunct company. However I do not accept it's current form of business model as one that can pay the bills and be in the best interest of commercial development. Sore, for community development it *can* be great - just not yet in our case.

The, saying applications should be Open Source still doesn't resolve the issue of how developers protect applications, and protect their copyright (irrespective of whether it is or is not warranted).

I would like to VERY strongly distance myself from your saying "The pirate is the entire nation of communist China", I think it is an egregious statement and you are out of line to say it. Lets us not be obtuse to where more cyber-piracy originates from in the first place - the West. So to say one society is immoral for burning it to a CD - which in another part of the country they're probably making the real things anyway - and to pretend that ours is not immoral for pirating from the employers or studios who paid for it in the first place is very misguided.

IMO.
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Uncle Ben Page Icon Posted 2005-04-13 12:02 PM
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To C:Amie - well said, and wise! I couldn't agree with you more.
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