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If there was a modern Psion or HP Jornada type computer that ran full Windows, would you buy one?

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If there was a modern Psion or HP Jornada type computer that ran full Windows, would you buy one?
OptionResults
yes (I would pay up to $600 to 900)35 Votes - [67.31%]
35 Votes [67.31%]
yes (I would pay up to $901 to $1500)2 Votes - [3.85%]
2 Votes [3.85%]
yes (I would pay up to $2000)1 Votes - [1.92%]
1 Votes [1.92%]
no14 Votes - [26.92%]
14 Votes [26.92%]

ExPsionMan Page Icon Posted 2008-02-19 2:16 PM
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Hi - This and the HTC Shift look the very interesting to me and so close to my requirements. The only facility stopping me buying is the lack of a USB Slave port and thus as far as I am aware will not be simple to sync Diary, Contacts and E-mail with desktop PC. I can't understand why manufactures don't offer this facility as I would have thought it would be relatively simple to include software that would do this and install a USB slave port on the mother board. -Though perhaps my lack of knowledge is the reason I think it ought not to be too complicated a task!

I don't like Windows Mobile, have tried several WM5 and WM6 devices and have found them all much slower at performing tasks than my Jornada 728. I would prefer to use Windows XP or Vista in my handheld device (with the above proviso), as I could then use a wide range of software and accessories and with standby or hibernate, the device would have a reasonable start up time. The "icing on the cake" would be a device about the same size as a Jornada 728, with LCD dimensions adjusted to provide full wide-screen and not half VGA or XVGA. The USB ports could be used to connect items such as DVD burner, etc.

Regards
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vrf Page Icon Posted 2008-02-22 8:20 PM
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Oo... the HP 2133 looks very nice. Near full-size keyboard makes it a lot more useful for me, but not so big as to not be mobile.

They better not put Vista in it. Can't stand machines that are physically mobile but not functionally so.

I wonder what the fastest booting Linux distro is...
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primaz Page Icon Posted 2008-02-25 1:35 PM
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ExPsionMan - 2008-02-19 2:16 PM

Hi - This and the HTC Shift look the very interesting to me and so close to my requirements. The only facility stopping me buying is the lack of a USB Slave port and thus as far as I am aware will not be simple to sync Diary, Contacts and E-mail with desktop PC. I can't understand why manufactures don't offer this facility as I would have thought it would be relatively simple to include software that would do this and install a USB slave port on the mother board. -Though perhaps my lack of knowledge is the reason I think it ought not to be too complicated a task!

I don't like Windows Mobile, have tried several WM5 and WM6 devices and have found them all much slower at performing tasks than my Jornada 728. I would prefer to use Windows XP or Vista in my handheld device (with the above proviso), as I could then use a wide range of software and accessories and with standby or hibernate, the device would have a reasonable start up time. The "icing on the cake" would be a device about the same size as a Jornada 728, with LCD dimensions adjusted to provide full wide-screen and not half VGA or XVGA. The USB ports could be used to connect items such as DVD burner, etc.

Regards


I agree. If a new device was designed around a typical jacket pocket, I think it could go up to about 4" to maybe even 4.25" in depth and the same 7.3" of the Jornada. That might enable an even better display and keyboard than even the Psion had? I would settle for either a Psion or Jornada with the internals of UMPC's like OQO and others which have already made them smaller than a Jornada.

I do not like the HP prototype UMPC as it really is the size of a laptop. It looks like the old 820, a CE device which sold very little as everyone wanted the portable 720/728. HP to me is making a big mistake as that device is too large. Thus it needs to be sold ultra cheap even to make any sales let alone any profits. If they made a 720 UMPC they would attract more mainstream users and could make money at the same time.
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chiark Page Icon Posted 2008-02-25 3:49 PM
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I'd possibly pay up to $500... I've never paid much for PDAs, and I'm not starting now
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takwu Page Icon Posted 2008-02-26 4:27 AM
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Interesting discussion here.

As some of you know, I am a proud owner of a Picturebook. Almost the size of a MobilePro, but it runs XP just fine. The 1280x600 screen is excellent for all software.

But as you might expect, battery life can be the downside of it. A standard size battery can go up to 3 hours (no wifi etc). And a double size battery gives you double that, which sticks out the bottom. Alternatively, you can hibernate and swap battery. With a fast harddrive (it takes regular 2.5 inch drives) you can hibernate and wake up reasonably quickly.

If you're looking for MobilePro size (not Jornada size), there are many choices still. Kohjinsha keeps coming up with newer models, and they have all been MP size. The latest one has a built-in DVD-R too. In USA those models are rebranded by Vye.

If you want a smaller computer, I agree that the Fujitsu is very close to a modern HPC. If I have to guess, I'd say the keyboard there is about Sig3 size. BTW the picture shown earlier in the thread has the fujitsu with the small battery. Here in Canada Fujitsu only offers that machine with the larger battery.
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DonL0001 Page Icon Posted 2008-02-26 4:38 AM
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takwu - 2008-02-26 5:27 AM

Interesting discussion here.

As some of you know, I am a proud owner of a Picturebook. Almost the size of a MobilePro, but it runs XP just fine. The 1280x600 screen is excellent for all software.

But as you might expect, battery life can be the downside of it. A standard size battery can go up to 3 hours (no wifi etc). And a double size battery gives you double that, which sticks out the bottom. Alternatively, you can hibernate and swap battery. With a fast harddrive (it takes regular 2.5 inch drives) you can hibernate and wake up reasonably quickly.

If you're looking for MobilePro size (not Jornada size), there are many choices still. Kohjinsha keeps coming up with newer models, and they have all been MP size. The latest one has a built-in DVD-R too. In USA those models are rebranded by Vye.

If you want a smaller computer, I agree that the Fujitsu is very close to a modern HPC. If I have to guess, I'd say the keyboard there is about Sig3 size. BTW the picture shown earlier in the thread has the fujitsu with the small battery. Here in Canada Fujitsu only offers that machine with the larger battery.


Can you reference a picturebook?

Thanks, Don
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ZSX Page Icon Posted 2008-02-26 3:45 PM
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This is a picture I took for a thread which was lost in the Great Server Crash.

Left to right:

  • Fujistu Lifebook P2120 (WinXP)

  • Samsung Izzi Pro (H/PC Pro)

  • Sony Vaio Picturebook C1M (Win98SE)

  • Palmax PD1000 (Win98 Gold)



It will give you an idea of the size of the Picturebook. Once again, the battery life is a super no-no. As you can tell, I also really like my subnotebooks!
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CAuser Page Icon Posted 2008-02-26 4:06 PM
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Let's see if HP/Compaq's new UMPC has an edge over others.
http://www.dynamism.com/hp2133/pricing.shtml
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papaken Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 11:57 AM
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Personally, I think the new VyePC S41 will be a pretty hot item:

http://www.vyeusa.com/S41.php?PHPSESSID=b9087234286f267004cd61d3ab1...

It is small, runs XP or Vista, has a nice swivel touch screen, decent keyboard, sound, wifi, bluetooth, scads of connectivity, 100 GB hard drive, up to 1 GB RAM, adaquate battery power, AND a built in DVD/CD drive!

Now THAT is getting close to what I want!
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mr-mac Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 12:31 PM
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papaken - 2008-02-27 4:57 PM

Personally, I think the new VyePC S41 will be a pretty hot item:

http://www.vyeusa.com/S41.php?PHPSESSID=b9087234286f267004cd61d3ab1...

It is small, runs XP or Vista, has a nice swivel touch screen, decent keyboard, sound, wifi, bluetooth, scads of connectivity, 100 GB hard drive, up to 1 GB RAM, adaquate battery power, AND a built in DVD/CD drive!

Now THAT is getting close to what I want!


I guess though to hold a CD/DVD drive it isn't going to be pocketable or psion sized...

Still quite nice looking
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papaken Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 1:15 PM
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mr-mac - 2008-02-27 12:31 PM

I guess though to hold a CD/DVD drive it isn't going to be pocketable or psion sized...

Still quite nice looking



Quite right. Still, to hold a cd it really only needs to be a little less than 5 inches wide - not that big, IMO.

The S41 is wider than that, so still a mini-laptop IMO. I would also like to see flash HDD and twice the battery power - though it is still a very nice device overall.

I would also like to see a clamshell that actually utilizes all the available upper frame width and height for screen use - which most fail to do. If you need some buttons on the side, fine - but USE what room you have!

Edited by papaken 2008-02-27 1:17 PM
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mobilesalesman Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 1:41 PM
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I think the HP UMPC along with the VyePC S41 Fujistu Lifebook P2120 (WinXP) ,Samsung Izzi Pro (H/PC Pro) ,Sony Vaio Picturebook C1M (Win98SE) Palmax PD1000 are too large and are really more like full laptops.

I do not think a modern Psion should have a CD/DVD as the limits in sizes of most coat pockets would be about 4.25" max and probably more like 4" would be better. You can load programs from a desktop and also use memory cards, etc. I think the idea of a modern Psion would be to have it jacket pocket size. Once it is too large to be carried in a larger pocket then it will be compared on a buyers purchasing decsion against all devices too large from laptops, subnotebooks, etc.

If a modern Psion has full Windows OS then it would warrant more than $500 as it would then go beyond the capabilities of any PDA. If a device only has Windows mobile or CE.net, and other OS that is short of desktop then it should be priced $500 and below to me. There is no form factor for everyone but what is missing is a new clamshell computer. Now that the UMPC technology can enable a full Windows computer to occupy the real estate of a small clamshell that would be a great device! Yes a full windows does not have instant on but it would not be a PDA anymore. There could be a market for a clamshell based on Windows mobile but it would need to sell at a lower price unit as it would be limited in software and more of a just a powerful PDA. I think there is a much larger market for a modern psion or HP that is jacket pocket size with full windows than any clamshell PDA.

Edited by mobilesalesman 2008-02-27 1:44 PM
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mr-mac Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 3:06 PM
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If they could shrink the HTCshift a tiny bit it would be perfect... would like to see one in the flesh as well
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ZSX Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 4:03 PM
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I think it is clear from the poll that most people would be happy to pay up to USD$900 for a device the size of a Psion/Jornada which runs Windows/Linux/OSX or some other x86 OS. Perhaps the follow on question should be what minimum battery life would be considered acceptable for such a device at that price point.

I keep beating the same drum, but with current battery technologies, a full range of connectivity options (BT, WLAN, WWAN, GPS) and a bright high-res screen (say WXGA minimum), we are looking at something with a 2 hour battery life tops, if that. Even the OQO Model 02 has a theoretical life of 3h on the 4500mAh battery, and in reality it is closer to 2 hours. A 9000mAh battery is over USD$100 alone, and as we know the 02 UMPC costs over £1000.

I'm not saying that it can't be done, but there is a reason why small, cheap, full-functioned and good battery life don't fit into the same package. Most devices mentioned in this thread hit only 2 of the 4 criteria.
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cmonex Page Icon Posted 2008-02-27 9:51 PM
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mr-mac - 2008-02-27 9:06 PM

If they could shrink the HTCshift a tiny bit it would be perfect... would like to see one in the flesh as well


i've seen it at 3GSM, sooo nice, if you shrink it it'd be perfect yes
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