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Recent Linux handheld phones (PinePhone, Astro Slide, F(x)tec)

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hpcboy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-28 5:06 AM
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Just discovered F(x)tec Pro1-X on Indiegogo today. Tribooting Android 9, Lineage OS (De-Googled), and Ubuntu Touch. Lower specs than Astro Slide but much better (and polished and usable) than PinePhone. I'm not certain if Ubuntu Touch is the best Linux OS on phones. The key(thumb)board on Pro1-X is a missed opportunity. It's too wide for a thumboard, and should follow Astro Slide's design which is very similar to that on the Psions and the HPCs (like Jornada).

Earlier on I backed PinePhone and Astro Slide, but in the end I cancelled both pledges. PinePhone is still very far from being a true consumer product. Astro Slide's form factor is not my favourite, and 5G development is full of uncertainty in the coming months. I wish Planet Computer's next project can retain the clamshell design as in Gemini PDA and provide a more than experiemental Linux experience.

Have you backed any of these projects and what do you think?
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Jake Page Icon Posted 2020-10-28 4:59 PM
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The trouble with Planet (I backed Gemini and Cosmo) is they make huge changes in hardware for each model, rather than perfecting an already-successful form. The Cosmo has a dual screen (with all kinds of problems) that the Gem did not, and now the Astro is a slider. Users are always at Alpha.

So I'm passing on the Astro in the hopes PC sticks with SOMETHING, then makes it better the second time around.

Jake
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HPC:Fan Page Icon Posted 2020-10-28 7:28 PM
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Jake - 2020-10-28 11:59 AM

The trouble with Planet (I backed Gemini and Cosmo) is they make huge changes in hardware for each model, rather than perfecting an already-successful form.


I agree with that. They should have kept what works and just made that better instead of trying to reinvent the wheel. But I'm happy that more phones are being released with QWERTY keys again. It's about time!
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ntware Page Icon Posted 2020-10-28 7:33 PM
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The F(x)tec keyboard reminds me of the squishy keys on earlier HPCs like 200lx. I wonder how usable that keyboard is, because the device seems more polished than the Astro. I have a Gemini, and although I really like it, there are several bugs I had to work around to make the device usable. Also, Gemini/Cosmo/Astro loses a huge amount of screen state with those large boarders. I like that the Pro1 has almost 100% screen state.
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Jake Page Icon Posted 2020-10-28 8:16 PM
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Yes, I was admiring the F(x)tec for everything except its keyboard. I will suffer the Gem/Cosmo indignities only for their fine keyboards (which are not perfect but make my work so much easier). And the Cosmo's backlighting gets my high marks as well.

And I share HPC:Fan's happiness that physical keyboards are coming back in any form.

Re: Cosmo's Linux woes. PC's latest Indiegogo follow-up has a video of a Linux release making/receiving calls, implementing data, and actually using the exterior display, both for its same uses in Android and as a mouse. So good on them.

Jake
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Mobi Page Icon Posted 2020-10-29 1:19 AM
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hpcboy - 2020-10-27 9:06 PM
Just discovered F(x)tec Pro1-X on Indiegogo today. Tribooting Android 9, Lineage OS (De-Googled), and Ubuntu Touch.


I don't think it multiboots. I believe that you have to make a choice of OS, though you can probably install any one of them.

I bought a Pinephone, but a functional OS is taking much too long to arrive and the promised clamshell keyboard is delayed (perhaps not coming at all). I won't be buying any unfinished products again in the near future.
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hpcboy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-29 3:19 AM
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Mobi - 2020-10-29 8:19 PM
I don't think it multiboots. I believe that you have to make a choice of OS, though you can probably install any one of them.

I bought a Pinephone, but a functional OS is taking much too long to arrive and the promised clamshell keyboard is delayed (perhaps not coming at all). I won't be buying any unfinished products again in the near future.


You are right. But I guess setting up GRUB won't be an issue if linux support is in place.

As for the Pinephone project, I was having very high hopes in the beginning because they seemed to be promising so much. But now on youtube there is still no actual demo but experiments with various rudimentary functions (booting up, receiving a call, switching menus, installing apps, ... and try not to freeze up). They do emphasize that it's primarily for developers, but I didn't expect the lack of progress along the way.

The clamshell design of Gemini PDA for me is a clear winner. Nokia N900 was such a well polished and mature product. It seems to me that many of these Linux projects have been reinventing the wheel instead of building upon previous successes.

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smb_gaiden Page Icon Posted 2020-10-29 3:51 PM
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hpcboy - 2020-10-28 7:19 PM

The clamshell design of Gemini PDA for me is a clear winner. Nokia N900 was such a well polished and mature product. It seems to me that many of these Linux projects have been reinventing the wheel instead of building upon previous successes.



I like the gemini, but mainly use it in rooted android. Use it less than expected due to less travels than anticipated when I originally backed it on indiegogo. My main criticisms of it are: 1) the fast charging standard selected is unpopular and most wall plugs, car plugs, and portable batteries take forever to charge it; and 2) the HDMI out is not part of the HDMI alternative mode of USB Type-C and requires the Planet adapter.

To get the ideal experience with it when carrying it along with other devices then you need a dedicated fast charge adapter like the one that came with it or the LG one that seems to work [1] (2nd thing to carry) and the special Type-C to HDMI adapter from Planet [2] (3rd thing to carry).

[1] [2] both referenced in a site someone linked here (I think) https://hasbrouck.org/blog/archives/002328.html
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hpcboy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-29 10:43 PM
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I like Gemini's form factor and keyboard because they are inherited directly from the Psion design. Didn't know anything about the charging issue of the Gemin, though. Proprietary adapter is always a very bad idea to the consumers, especially nowadays and for such a small company.
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Mobi Page Icon Posted 2020-10-30 12:17 AM
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hpcboy - 2020-10-28 7:19 PM

As for the Pinephone project, I was having very high hopes in the beginning because they seemed to be promising so much. But now on youtube there is still no actual demo but experiments with various rudimentary functions (booting up, receiving a call, switching menus, installing apps, ... and try not to freeze up). They do emphasize that it's primarily for developers, but I didn't expect the lack of progress along the way.


There are a couple of OSes that work to an extent, but people mention missed calls and texts, and battery life isn't spectacular. They did emphasize when I bought it that it was a developer/early adopter device, but there were also suggestions that UB Ports and others would be 'available' within a couple of months. I suppose I should have read that more skeptically.

In any case, I've gone back to a flip phone. It limits my tendency to surf mindlessly whenever I'm bored.
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daemonspudguy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-30 12:27 AM
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I'm just happy that PinePhone has actually came out and you can buy one. Not something I can say about the Librem 5. I really want one of Planet's devices but don't have the cash right now. If anyone here has one, I am curious to know how they are to use as phones.
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hpcboy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-30 12:44 AM
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The USD$2,000 Librem 5 is unbelivable unless perhaps it's marketed to budget-insensitive government departments or security agencies. Almost identical specs as PinePhone (which are already a couple of generations behind the trend). Development progress sounds like a fairy tale.
My 3 year old LG Android phone is getting rather aged and broken here and there (mic not working, headset jack fails, etc.), which is so typical of devices nowaways. So I am also anticipating a good alternative and replacement. I was once very tempted to buy a Gemini, but it was too early back then when I had just got my LG not long before. Now after hearing some of the prominent shortcomings of Planet's products I am becoming not so hopeful now.
Linux phones (except for Nokia N900) have always been struggling poorly on the consumer market. I wonder if I should just look for a De-Googled Android phone (Lineage OS?) once mine ceases working... or a seriously just nice flip phone.
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hpcboy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-30 9:14 AM
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The Regiter has covered the latest firmware update for Debian on Cosmo Commuicator. The story sounds promising and satisfying, while the comments mostly say otherwise.
https://www.theregister.com/AMP/2020/10/28/planet_computers_cosmo_co...
Typical for small developers, but still it's a pity every time seeing such a great project as Gemini being left behind and forgotten in just few short years.
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ntware Page Icon Posted 2020-10-30 2:56 PM
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hpcboy - 2020-10-28 10:19 PM

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Mobi - 2020-10-29 8:19 PM
I don't think it multiboots. I believe that you have to make a choice of OS, though you can probably install any one of them.

I bought a Pinephone, but a functional OS is taking much too long to arrive and the promised clamshell keyboard is delayed (perhaps not coming at all). I won't be buying any unfinished products again in the near future.


You are right. But I guess setting up GRUB won't be an issue if linux support is in place.


GRUB? ARM devices are a little more complicated than that. GRUB is a bootloader for x86 computers. On the ARM world, people usually use uBoot, which is a pain to setup and configure. That's why you don't see ARM devices dual-booting every day, or when they do dual boot, it requires weird key press combinations.
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hpcboy Page Icon Posted 2020-10-30 5:05 PM
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ntware - 2020-10-31 9:56 AM
GRUB? ARM devices are a little more complicated than that. GRUB is a bootloader for x86 computers. On the ARM world, people usually use uBoot, which is a pain to setup and configure. That's why you don't see ARM devices dual-booting every day, or when they do dual boot, it requires weird key press combinations.


I am not so sure about this. I am not too familiar with linux. The man page seems to say something different however: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/bionic/man8/grub-install.8.html
--target=TARGET 
              install  GRUB  for  TARGET  platform [default=i386-pc]; available targets: arm-efi, 
arm-uboot, arm64-efi, i386-coreboot, i386-efi, i386-ieee1275, i386-multiboot,
i386-pc, i386-qemu, i386-xen, ia64-efi, mips-arc, mips-qemu_mips, mipsel-arc,
mipsel-loongson, mipsel-qemu_mips, powerpc-ieee1275, sparc64-ieee1275, x86_64-efi,
x86_64-xen


and also this: https://wiki.parabola.nu/ARM_Installation_Guide#GRUB
13.1.4 GRUB 
grub claims some support for ARMv7 machines with EFI support (GRUB#UEFI_systems).


There's even a rather recent Debian version of GRUB for ARM:
https://packages.debian.org/buster/grub-efi-arm


Edited by hpcboy 2020-10-30 5:23 PM
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