Best HPC for mobile use in a rough environment?

I am in the process of developing a new process for my department at work. I want an affordable easy to use small handheld to use in process audits, would have to have pocket office, with excel. I was thinking about "Windows XP embedded" for the OS. I think I can get a developers copy to use since I work for a major corporation, I have a small budget, but large enough to afford a quality unit. I would need a very durable unit because it would be handed off to different auditors each shift in a manufacturing environment. I would also want something that would last. Has anyone worked with XP embedded? Any suggestions would be great.

Edit:
The reason I want to use XP embedded is I want to learn it and My manager wants me to use it.

Edited by Yoldering 2005-03-09 12:53 AM

Its probably not as good as CE...

hmmm Windows XP Embedded...sounds interesting...but i never heard of a handheld computer that uses Windows XP Embedded.

but Windows Embedded (without XP), i think, is a generic term for all of microsoft's operating systems that were designed for small handheld computers.

microsoft is confusing with all the names.

Well if you need Pocket Office, you have to stop right here, and look at Linux options.

Windows XP Embedded and Windows CE are Operating Systems, when you buy Windows XP Professional off the shelf it doesn't come with MS Office.
The same is true with both Windows CE and Windows XP Embedded.

EDIT: The fex21 is a ruggedised hpc2000 device :. Pocket Office:
http://www.itronix.com/products/hpcs.asp

I checked out the FEX21, looks a lot like what I need, a little big though. For now I will use my Jornada 680e, (Prototype) for the project anyway. I like it a lot more than I thought. I would actually need something smaller though. I heard about windows embedded from my manager through this site http://www.microsoft.com/windows/embedded/default.mspx
The thought of a free windows XP OS system I could play with is cool, though I thought is might come with office. Anyway windows CE on the Jornada will work fine for the time being. Any options on newer units would be greatly appreciated!!!
Can anyone check if XP Embedded will work on any of the J-series?

Nope, I doubt XPembedded will work on any of these devices as it is. ...

The XP devices are the Vulcan Flipstart www flipstart.com, and the OQO www.oqo.com.

It is weird: the more I look into XP embedded the more I don’t like it. What is it for?!!! I thought is would be for a HPC, you know what we all know and love. Does anyone know what system it would work on? For some reason my company wants me to use it. I don’t see why the people that will be using it will know anything more about it that CE. I think they think the support will not be there in the future.

holy cr#p those devices are sweeet. Although way too expensive for me. Wow they are small! My budget is for a unit that will be passed between 4 people, and if it works it will go plant wide. Something like that would be way too much of a temptation to steel.

I do not know the full implementation of the process/system you have in mind. But with wifi access today, would it not be better to have a HPC (eg J680e or something) to access some backend store data than to have one unit passed around?

That way, whatever device it is, it will be assigned to that person and he will be responsible for it.

But, that's a logistic issue, and there are many ways to skin a cat. (No, I'm not into killing or animal cruelty! )

I agree, though I'm not sure how much longer the 680 will be around. I will use my 680e for testing until I can find a suitable replacement. I need warranties and support! People are rough on things they do not own.

ya ... that's true. 680es are just going on its old stock or refurbished/used ones right now. Its been awhile since HP EOLed it. The very word!

And its true too, that some people just do not take care of community/company property very well!

I sometimes wonder what's going on in the minds of these folks who vandalises ... don't they realise that by doing so it only raises the cost of upkeeping the environment? That would translate to a reason for higher tax! Not that tax will disappear when we all be nice and not vandalise ... but for pete's sake, if you want to vandalise ... do it at home. Or something. Not at other's expense.

The most important reason for this project is less paperwork., I guess you could say paper conservation. We waste sooooo much paper. I also need to track discrepancies, online that would be great. The people who will use this equipment are not the brightest people. Also the paper trail is hard to follow.

Windows XP embeded is an operating system, just like XP.
However, there are no handheld devices that it specificaly comes with.

For the record, Windows CE was not specificaly designed for handheld devices. It's the other way around.

Microsoft uses embedded windows operating systems for RTOS (RealTime Operating System) and originaly has been designed to compete with operating systems such as QNX.

Current implementations of Windows Embedded (XP/CE) are things like ATM's, or even the Sega DreamCast.
Those devices run a custom designed interface build upon a Windows CE core operating system, but do not have the looks of windows.

Might be interesting for someone to make a nice history and usage list or something concerning Windows CE.

Windows CE as we all know from HPC's and PPC's is just a small part of the embedded industry.


Above mentioned devices such as the vulcan and oqo use a full fledged laptop build with small parts. Windows is also loaded on a harddisk, and thus requires boot-time and moving parts. These devices, unlike HPC's are not shock proof, and can not last in an industrial enviroment.
Windows CE (and Windows XP Embedded, as well as QNX or Linux embedded) are designed to run from a rom chip instead of a harddisk.
For updates of the operating system, either a full rom image needs to be put into the device, or the update needs to be loaded into user memory. For a mini computer with a full-fledged OS, you can just replace updated files with newer ones.

To be able to install Windows XP Embedded on a HPC device, you would probably need Platform Builder from Microsoft to create an image for the device you want to put it on.
However, devices commercialy availiable have no support directly in Platform Builder to create a valid ROM image that you can FLASH onto your device.
To be able to create a valid image you would need to have access to the builder plugins that the original manufacturer uses. They will only let you do that if you purchase an OEM license, and for just a single unit they would laugh.


Windows XP Embedded is mainly used for electronics manufacturers that provide an OS on their custom, non-pc devices.

A cash register at your local WalMart can be running Windows XP Embedded. The payment screen of a fuel pump can as well. The same as for example a DishNetwork Satelite receiver is running linux.



So unless you are actually designing and building your own device, with a commercial purpose, there is no way to actualy purchase a hpc or ppc-like device that will run Windows XP Embedded.

Look at it more like Linux.

Windows XP Embedded is basicaly compareable to the Linux commandline.
the core. On top of that you install the X-server/Graphics output, if required. Then you can choose from 100's of different WindowManagers for the graphical shell. Ypou can have it look like windows, or you can install a TIVO-like interface, and on and on.


Depending on your needs of Office,
Most Windows CE versions that are availiable on the HPC/PPC devices include a version of PocketWord and PocketExcel.

If those are not sufficient, a Linux-Based handheld like the Sharp Zaurus range will allow you to use full fledged linux applications, as long as you have the storage availiable.

An option I'd recommend though is using Citrix or Terminal Server instead.
Basicaly all you need then is a device with network access, either wireless or phoneline, and connect to a server providing the full-fledged applications.
The only limitation you will have then is the screensize.

I played with Citrix on HPC and PPC devices, and it's possible to even run PhotoShop on a 320x240 screen.
Not really workable, but I was able to use my stylus for drawing, and that was nice.

Opening Word andExcel files, also no problem. And using these methods, processor power and memory are no concern. Just the screensize and if you have a keyboard or not.

Terminal Server just opens a desktop screen to the server, and allows you to use the programs from that screen. Citrix works similair, but actually allows you to publish shortcuts on the handhelds desktop to start an application on the server directly.

To have an idea of how it sort of works, look at the VNC article on this site.

Goodluck


Sincerly,

PD


Edited by PocketDVD 2005-03-10 12:13 AM

Thanks for the info on XP embedded.