x
This website is using cookies. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. More info. That's Fine
HPC:Factor Logo 
 
Latest Forum Activity

Mad programming idea again ???

1 2
wallythacker Page Icon Posted 2005-08-03 7:28 PM
#
Avatar image of wallythacker
H/PC Elder

Posts:
2,156
Location:
Barrie, Ontario
Status:
Am I right in saying that programs in CEF format will execute on all platforms?

How about de-compliing a CEF format program and then compile to a specific cpu. Wouldn't that provide better code for the cpu to munch?

Or, is there a program to take a non CEF program and convert it to CEF? I'm always thinking of ways to broaden the hpc world

Edited by wallythacker 2005-08-03 7:31 PM
 Top of the page
C:Amie Page Icon Posted 2005-08-03 7:35 PM
#
Avatar image of C:Amie
Administrator
H/PC Oracle

Posts:
18,007
Location:
United Kingdom
Status:
Pop goes the weasle.

Yes assuming the cef bits are there.

Name many cef binaries...?
 Top of the page
wallythacker Page Icon Posted 2005-08-03 7:50 PM
#
Avatar image of wallythacker
H/PC Elder

Posts:
2,156
Location:
Barrie, Ontario
Status:
I just knew you'd ask that I'll look in my archive, tho' I think I purged most CEF stuff not realizing what it was at the time. I just thought it was another weird cpu platform.

edit: Hmm, couldn't any program for ce cpus be de-compiled and then compiled for a different chip?

What de-compiler would I use should I find some CEFS to mess with? And would I use the hpc2k SDK to re-compile? Basic dumb questions but this is new to me.

Edited by wallythacker 2005-08-03 7:56 PM
 Top of the page
wallythacker Page Icon Posted 2005-08-04 12:58 AM
#
Avatar image of wallythacker
H/PC Elder

Posts:
2,156
Location:
Barrie, Ontario
Status:
I found a CEF file. Now what?




Attachments
----------------
Attachments AltF4close.cef.zip (1KB - 30 downloads)
 Top of the page
C:Amie Page Icon Posted 2005-08-04 6:33 AM
#
Avatar image of C:Amie
Administrator
H/PC Oracle

Posts:
18,007
Location:
United Kingdom
Status:
Now find the source code and recompile it
It's a binary file, it's no different from a .4000 cab in that respect.
 Top of the page
wallythacker Page Icon Posted 2005-08-04 11:15 AM
#
Avatar image of wallythacker
H/PC Elder

Posts:
2,156
Location:
Barrie, Ontario
Status:
I heard there's a dis-assembler for ARM stuff used by um, experimenters. I'l google for a mips one, or maybe someone here knows of one.

Can I re-compile right after a dis-assembly? Then try to figure out the compiler error messages?

I've downloaded all the hpc2k pertinent stuff (I think, I have the SDK, and some 300mb thing, and some other goodies from links provided here.)

My background consists of 6502 ASM, Pascal and C programming *many* moons ago.
This might be a good way for me to get my feet wet again? Yay/nay?
 Top of the page
Pete P. Page Icon Posted 2005-08-04 11:32 AM
#
Avatar image of Pete P.
H/PC Philosopher

Posts:
265
Location:
Boston
Status:
Hurray for 8 bit! (I know a bit of 6502 myself :-)
 Top of the page
wallythacker Page Icon Posted 2005-08-04 1:42 PM
#
Avatar image of wallythacker
H/PC Elder

Posts:
2,156
Location:
Barrie, Ontario
Status:
LOL, we should work at NASA. AFAIK the 6502 still runs the Shuttle.
 Top of the page
sophisticatedleaf Page Icon Posted 2005-08-06 9:20 PM
#
Avatar image of sophisticatedleaf
H/PC Elder

Posts:
2,294
Location:
Sunny California
Status:
Yay for the 6502 and 8-bit! (I like old technology)

Anyone else building a Replica I?
 Top of the page
Snappy! Page Icon Posted 2005-08-07 8:21 AM
#
Avatar image of Snappy!
H/PC Elder

Posts:
1,712
Location:
New Mexico, US
Status:
wallythacker - 2005-08-04 11:42 AM

LOL, we should work at NASA. AFAIK the 6502 still runs the Shuttle.


Really? ... that explains alot!! ... so why are we paying NASA boys $billions of tax dollars??

hey PS, when you are done with the 6502, I expect no less than a round-trip to moon from you!
 Top of the page
bruisedquasar Page Icon Posted 2005-08-07 6:40 PM
#
Avatar image of bruisedquasar
H/PC Philosopher

Posts:
317
Location:
United States
Status:
Snappy! - 2005-08-07 8:21 AM

Really? ... that explains alot!! ... so why are we paying NASA boys $billions of tax dollars??


Congress shares in the blame. They nixed NASA's plans for a new shuttle fleet, which should be flying by now. The current fleet is old and dangerous. The state does at least two things terribly: Play parent and explore new worlds.

NASA should be downsized to a small department of administrative-type government scientists and the billions awarded to private non-profit space groups, like the one who did two space flights using mostly old NASA surplus. They want to set up a space station for tourists using old NASA Titan Rocket shells and other "scrap". NASA doesn't want them to have the scrap!

Russian space scientists tried to get an international mission to mars going. It was killed by NASA opposition. Said "a manned mission to MARS is too dangerous."

Good thing the American frontier was not managed by NASA. We would just now be reaching the Ohio River. With each Indian raid or death by adverse environment NASA would have shut down wagon trains & investigated how OTHERS messed up. The Mormon migration to Utah would still be on hold.

---Bruised

 Top of the page
Snappy! Page Icon Posted 2005-08-08 8:44 AM
#
Avatar image of Snappy!
H/PC Elder

Posts:
1,712
Location:
New Mexico, US
Status:
and we would have the Collective States of East America with like what ... 5 states?

What a turn in History, with the wrong right person at the helm!
 Top of the page
HDH Page Icon Posted 2005-08-08 11:46 AM
#
Avatar image of HDH
Factorite (Junior)

Posts:
36
Location:
East Anglia, UK
Status:
wallythacker - 2005-08-04 6:42 PM

LOL, we should work at NASA. AFAIK the 6502 still runs the Shuttle.


Don't laugh, the last Mars mission craft was equipped with a RAD6000 with 20 Mhz and 128 Mb DRAM running VxWorks. Makes the shuttle look like hardly used in computer terms.

The next craft will probably be equipped with a RAD750 running with 133 Mhz.

You see all these old programming skills can come handy again in the world of space travel


 Top of the page
Zapper Page Icon Posted 2005-08-08 3:02 PM
#
Avatar image of Zapper
Factorite (Elite)

Posts:
138
Status:
Snappy! - 2005-08-07 8:21 AM

Really? ... that explains alot!! ... so why are we paying NASA boys $billions of tax dollars??


It's not some great conspiracy, mate. It's physics. Here on the planetary surface, we can get away with shrinking the transistor sizes and circuit paths and running up the speeds. But above the atmosphere, you don't get any protection from cosmic rays, gamma ray bursts, high energy neutral particles, etc. Above the radiation belts, you don't even get any protection from the ions in the solar wind or worse, the ion storm from a solar flare or coronal mass ejection event.

The older processes used in the older chips are big. Say 1.35 micron technology, whereas we are now at 0.09 microns and shrinking even further. You can even get some things at 0.065 microns, and 0.045 is around the corner. But the smaller the process, the more susceptible it is to damage from high energy subatomic particles and careening atomic nuceli.

It's like legos. imagine you built a clock out of legos, but you used jumbo toddler blocks. The clock would be big, heavy, slow, and consume a lot of power to run. But you could likely shoot it several times with a .22 or 9mm and it would still work. The bullets just punch small holes but essentially goes right through. Now, build the same clock but with standard size lego blocks. The clock would be smaller, faster, consume less power.. But a single .22 varmint round would blow it away.

In space, size matters. At least when one is talking microns and nanometres.

But it doesn't stop there, of course. Semiconductors come in commercial, military, and aerospace specifications. The latter have to work in vacuum, under extreme vibration and thermal shock, and operate in conditions from -100C to +250C. Special ceramic packaging, thick precious metal contacts, miniature faraday cage meshes built into the epoxy overcoat, surge isolation and swing dampers everywhere..

And before you know it, a $0.25 obsolete part becomes a $500 component of an umpteen-million-dollar satelite.

Of course, you could stick a top of the line modern processor into your expensive satelite, and have truly astounding performance. For a very, very short time. Then it becomes malfunctioning space junk.

 Top of the page
Snappy! Page Icon Posted 2005-08-08 4:01 PM
#
Avatar image of Snappy!
H/PC Elder

Posts:
1,712
Location:
New Mexico, US
Status:
Zapper - 2005-08-08 1:02 PM

...
And before you know it, a $0.25 obsolete part becomes a $500 component of an umpteen-million-dollar satelite.

Of course, you could stick a top of the line modern processor into your expensive satelite, and have truly astounding performance. For a very, very short time. Then it becomes malfunctioning space junk.



Then the radio log would go like ... ...

Eagle1: "Houston ... we are on approach trajectory ... "
CommandCentre: "Roger that. Maintain course ... "
...
CC: "Eagle1, you need to make adjustment to your yaw by 1.457deg."
Eagle1: "Copy that. Engaging yaw thrusters ... "
...
CC: "Eagle1, you are still off course. Yaw adjustments ... "
Eagle1: "Houston, we've tried to ... I think we've got a problem ... "
CC: "What's the problem Eagle1, over ... "
Eagle1: "What does 'mfc300.dll missing. Memory corrupted ... ' mean??? ... "
CC: "... ..."
...
Eagle1: "CC, do you copy the last error message? ... "
...
CC: "err ... I think your MP900 module FLASH ROM just got corrupted ... "
Eagle1: "*gulp* ... ... "
...
Eagle1: "errr ... so ... what does that mean? ... "
CC: "Can you upload OpenEagle OS and try if you can fix it ... "

 Top of the page
1 2
Jump to forum:
Seconds to generate: 0.296 - Cached queries : 51 - Executed queries : 31